Joe Cretella, Oral History

 

Recorded: May 14, 2020

Interviewed by Benjamin V. Allison

Transcribed by the Kent State University Research & Evaluation Bureau

 

[Interviewer]: This is Ben Allison speaking on May 14, 2020, conducting a phone interview as part of the May 4 Kent State Shootings Oral History Project. Could you please state your name for the recording?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Colonel Joe Cretella.

 

[Interviewer]: Thank you. First of all, Colonel Cretella, we would like to thank you for your willingness to contribute to this important archive of historical memory and we’re looking forward to hearing your story. I would like to begin with just some brief information about your background so we can get to know you a little bit better. [00:00:47] Can you tell us where you were born and where you grew up?

 

[Joe Cretella]: I grew up in Gerard, Ohio. I was born in Youngstown, Ohio. Attended Ursuline High School and then I attended Youngstown State University where I was commissioned a lieutenant in the United States Army, regular army. And then I served several years and, then in 1969, I received a notice of assignment to Kent State University. I was there from 1969 to 1973 as an army captain, part of the ROTC faculty. I served as the A-P-M-S [editor’s clarification: Assistant Professor of Military Science], Assistant P-M-S, served many more years in Germany, Vietnam, Korea.

 

In 1983, I received another assignment, a directed assignment because Kent State wanted someone who was a graduate of Kent State to be the professor of military science. I have a master’s degree from Kent State in educational administration. I was there from 1983 through 1986 as the professor of military science.

 

After retiring from the Army, I became the dean of enrollment management at Shippensburg University for fifteen years. I was in charge of admissions, financial aid, registrar, and several other departments. I retired in Shippensburg, Pennsylvania, and I have been performing community service, et cetera.

 

[Interviewer]: Wonderful. Well, thank you very much.

 

[Joe Cretella]: Oh, I did forget, after I retired, I did go work for the College Board for two years.

 

[Interviewer]: Oh, wow, okay. Thank you. So, could you tell us about your role as a faculty member? The courses you taught, your department, things like that?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Sure. I was teaching primarily the third-year juniors on different topics from leadership management to legal law and there were courses in, I’m trying to remember other courses now. Primarily, that was—

 

[Interviewer]: Sorry, just to clarify, is this when you were initially teaching in the late ‘60s, early ‘70s, or when you were teaching in the 1980s?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Oh, no. When I was teaching as the professor of military. As a captain, I was teaching at the sophomore level for the MSII [editor’s clarification: second year cadet student] and I taught courses in map reading and military leadership, and I think there was a third course that I had, but which—oh, the ethics course, yes, military ethics.

 

[Interviewer]: Okay. All right, thank you for that answer. So, then that was under the auspices of ROTC, correct?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Correct.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:04:13] How did you view the protests and the Vietnam War when you first arrived on campus?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Well, funny enough, there were marches around the ROTC Building on campus, daily. In fact, we had an issue one time where cars were keyed and a couple windows smashed. I remember I had a brand new VW Beetle [00:04:40] that I picked up in Cuyahoga Falls at the VW dealer and came out and the car had to be towed away. But it was nothing that we felt threatened about. They were always just marching around, singing their songs, holding their signs. But we never had anybody try to bust into the building.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:05:04] And how did you view the war at that time?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Well, I viewed it because I had just returned from the war, the Vietnam, on my year tour there, first one. And so, it was a little disheartening, but it never felt threatened, never felt that they, they had their right to protest because that’s what I served for: freedom.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:05:32] How would you describe the prevailing attitudes or the mood on campus in the spring of 1970?

 

[Joe Cretella]: In 1970, it got a little bit more testy. There were a lot more outsiders were coming in as speakers, speaking from The Commons and other places on campus, and it got a little bit more violent. I remember a fellow captain and I sat in the back of our auditorium and there were speakers on that. And then they finally—we were in civilian clothes, we were not in uniform, and somehow a person up on the stage said, “Well, you know you’ve got two army guys sitting in this auditorium.” And then, all of a sudden, they started screaming and yelling and so we decided it was best to leave. How they identified us, I don’t know.

 

[Interviewer]: And did you feel threatened at all during that particular incident, or was that just something where you decided it was best to duck out?

 

[Joe Cretella]: It was best [unintelligible], no, our professional training said, Don’t get involved. In fact, that was one of our responsibilities on campus was not to get involved in some of the campus protests and we just decided it was best that we leave. There was University Police in the back and they recognized us and said, “Okay, thanks. We’ll get you out to your car.”

 

[Interviewer]: [00:07:09] How politically involved or active would you describe yourself at the time? I’m assuming that you, of course, didn’t participate in any of the protests?

 

[Joe Cretella]: No. No activation, not politically screaming and yelling for a particular issue or candidate or whatever. But, obviously in ethics class, we did speak to that, to the ROTC cadets of what was going on in the news and the situation on campus. But we never encouraged them or, in fact, we cautioned them [against] becoming involved. And that’s what I will speak [to] when we get to Mr. Schroeder. I spoke—I had his class that morning on May 4^th.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:07:56] Do you remember the environment in your classes in the spring of 1970?

 

[Joe Cretella]: With the ROTC cadets, I did not experience any pushes or signs—some of them would ask questions, “Why is this occurring? Why is this happening?” Nothing—I never remember any cadet who would be in there and the freshmen and sophomore year is voluntary, so therefore, there could have been individuals in there who were not truly dedicated to the Army, but wanted to take the classes. But I never had any outburst, any screams that, this is not right, or this is wrong.

 

[Interviewer]: But you said that you had students who would ask why certain things were going on. Was that, from what you can remember, did they seem concerned or was it a curiosity thing?

 

[Joe Cretella]: I think it was concern. They were students and, obviously, they lived on campus. It was all around them, as you remember, there were posters all over the campus and on and on. Some of them wanted to express, “Why do they get the authority to do this? How do they get—if my fraternity wants to have something, we have to get a permit, we had to do this, we have to schedule it. How do these people just show up on campus and do things?” It was a part of a concern, probably. And a question of the administration allowing it to occur.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:09:48] So, prior to the shootings, what was your sense of how local Kent community members perceived the Kent State students?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Before the shooting, before the burning of the building?

 

[Interviewer]: Yes sir.

 

[Joe Cretella]: No, I lived in that area. In fact, at that time, I was living in Stow, Ohio, and it was—the community did not seem that involved with it. They just kind of said, That’s college students just, you know, letting off steam. I remember we were down at the Pufferbelly [editor’s clarification: The Pufferbelly Restaurant] and having something to eat and drink and there were a few students that were there and they just said something on their way out to us, “Baby killers” or whatever it was, but nothing that’s—nothing was ever, that I sensed, that there was a community thrust to have demonstrations and all that.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:10:52] So, tell me about your experiences during the period of April 30^th to May 4^th , 1970.

 

[Joe Cretella]: Okay, on April 30^th, well, I think that’s when I had a class. And then, on Friday, we were preparing the cadets because on Saturday morning, May 1^st, we were going to a rifle range to get the students to let them fire the weapons because they were going to a summer camp where they would have regular training. So, we were getting them familiar on Saturday morning and we left campus and we went out to a place where there’s a rifle range and when that was over, about one o’clock, one-thirty. We locked all the weapons into the building and there was ammunition in the building because, when the fire occurred, they heard stuff burnt, popping off, because there was ammunition in the building.

 

At that time, my wife—because Friday, I took her to Akron General Hospital to have our second child.  So, after we finished the training on Saturday, I went to Akron General Hospital where she was about ready to have our second child. And, while I was there, I remember it was right about five o’clock, and the doctor said, "Well, the Kentucky Derby was coming on,” but he said, “Let me know what’s going on. I have money on it.” I said, “Okay, doc.” Well, just about that time when she had—he comes out and says, “You have a daughter.” And I told him who won the race and he said, “Dang, I lost.” But, I got a call from the State Police. This was about six thirty, six o’clock, and the State Police knew that I had the keys to the building on me. And they asked me to get to the campus as soon as possible. And I got to the campus and they met me at the gate on Main Street next to Rockwell Hall, and they escorted me back to the ROTC Building, and the building, as you know, at that point, was on fire.

 

The building—I was trying to find out what was going on. How could we get this stopped? The fire department, as you remember, backed their trucks up. Mr. Peach, the university fire marshal, and I drove the truck down to the building and started putting water on it. Yes, there was some people throwing things at us but, never felt threatened.

 

So then, on Sunday, we were down there. As you see, there are many pictures showing the FBI and the state investigator, fire marshals, and everything else around the building, checking things. And we saw that the weapons were still in the racks, so that was the first accountability we had to do to ensure we had every weapon. Most of them were burnt.

 

And then, on Monday, I had a class, one of the sophomore classes, and Mr. Schroeder was in my class. At the end of the class, and the demonstration was going on in The Commons, I said, “Gentlemen, ladies, do not walk across The Commons. Walk around it, stay out of this.” And within hours, within an hour or two, as you know, there was a shooting and we were standing down by the ROTC Building. We had no idea what had happened, how it happened but, at that point, we received later in the day that one of our cadets and one of the four students killed, was Bill Schroeder. He was an ROTC Cadet.

 

So, yes, Mr. Peach and I have had conversations after this, many years, talked about how we drove the fire truck down. He said, “We were impeding with the fire department, but they weren’t going back down there because they were getting pelted. And things were being thrown at them. But we moved it down there.” I was in civilian clothes at that time, not in a uniform, and we started putting water on the building, but to no avail.

 

[Interviewer]: So, when you checked for the weapons, you found that they were all there, correct?

 

[Joe Cretella]: They were all accounted for, yes. In racks, they were in locked, metal, military racks.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:15:40] Okay. And so, you mentioned how Bill Schroeder was one of the students who was shot, and unfortunately died in the shootings. How did you feel when you learned that?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Well, I was really upset. I was a little shaken because, when you come back from Vietnam and things like this occur, shootings occur and death occurs, I was just,  I remember, I felt my body just stiffen up like, You got to be kidding me. And I remember the professor of military science who was Colonel Arthur Dotson, he said, “We need to do something here.”  And I told him, we need to call our higher headquarters and that’s when all of the—because the FBI and that was already involved, but we needed to tell them that there was a shooting on campus of one of our cadets before it hit the news media.

 

So, we were working and we were dealing with securing the building, too, because there was other stuff in the building. I lost a lot of my personal effects, some of my awards that I had received in Vietnam were burnt. They were replaced by the Army for me. Not the same signature, but they were replaced. And we had to secure the building and so, that Monday was kind of a day of just standing around and just wondering what happened and how could this happen.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:17:20] So, what were the days and weeks like after May 4^th?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Well, I think days and after, we had several meetings with university officials trying to determine where they were going to put us. There was, as you know, there was some faculty demonstration about removing ROTC from the campus. In fact, I remember, I was the officer in charge of the contract with the Liquid Crystal Institute and I remember mentioning to the president, “I assume if ROTC goes, that contract goes.” And he just kind of looked up at me and grinned, like, Oh no, that ain’t gonna happen. So, but there were faculty that were writing letters, writing things in the Kent Stater about ROTC should be removed from campus, the normal stuff you would get on college campuses.

 

But we were trying, they were trying to determine what is our posture on campus at that time and where were they going to move our offices. We were eventually moved to Rockwell Hall, the second floor and, remember, there was Air Force ROTC there also at the time.

 

[Interviewer]: So, when you had that conversation with, I believe you said it was the president, right?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Yeah, president and certain staff members. I don’t remember names and positions, but there were several administrators in the room.

 

[Interviewer]: And so, was it just yourself and the administration in the room, or was someone else?

 

[Joe Cretella]: No, no, it was the professor, the Colonel Dotson and myself because I had, I was responsible for the building and the facilities. That was one of my additional duties and another two captains were with me. No, there was a major with me. Bob, let me think of his name, he was a major. He also was in the room with us. And it was a meeting called, meet with the president. Obviously, they assured us that we were all okay. They assured us that they were going to support us but, at the same time, there was this discussion going on campus about removing ROTC from the campus, but that all kind of subsided even after the grand jury started, I guess.

 

I did get a call while I was in Germany—I left Kent State and went to Germany and I did get a call a couple times from the coordinator of the Ohio Grand Jury asking me questions. There was a point that I had to get a clearance from my boss that I would be able to return to Kent, Ohio, to testify, but eventually, that was not required.

 

[Interviewer]: So, in that meeting with the administration, when you mentioned the thing about the Liquid Crystal contract, what was—

 

[Joe Cretella]: Well they asked us what other things we had around campus and that was, I’d mentioned the Liquid Crystal contract, right. Because it was with the U.S. Army.

 

[Interviewer]: When you mentioned that, were you mentioning that just kind of in an off-hand manner? Just like, Hey, this is something you should think about. Or was that something you were using as an argument?

 

[Joe Cretella]: No, I think they asked us the question, What else do we have connections to on campus? It was not an impromptu, it was answering to a question that I was responsible for the contract with the Liquid Crystal Institute and there were many military students that were on campus who were active duty military, but going to college, getting their undergraduate degree and several were getting their master’s degree. I think even one was in the doctorate program. So, I mentioned—what other Army connections or Army relations do we have on campus, and that’s when I mentioned that one.

 

[Interviewer]: And approximately when did that meeting take place?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Let’s see, it could have been, I don’t remember the exact day, it’s been a few years. Getting a little bit older. But it was like the middle of—it wasn’t Monday, it wasn’t Tuesday, it was later that week, maybe towards Thursday, Friday, at the end of the week. The president did come down and the vice presidents did come down to the campus, I mean, down to the ROTC building where we were working on with the FBI and the fire marshal to do the paperwork on the building and the assets that were there. But I think it was towards the end of the week. It was not a long meeting, maybe an hour at the most, could’ve been at the end of that week or first part of the next week. But he had been down and spoke to us many times.

 

[Interviewer]: Okay. And when you said earlier that you had, at one point, left Kent State and gone off to Germany. When was that?

 

[Joe Cretella]: That would be 1986.

 

[Interviewer]: Okay, so it was much later that the grand jury called.

 

[Joe Cretella]: No, I’m sorry. ‘73, I’m sorry, I got two tours there. In 1973. I left about September, right after the school year started, September, October, my replacement came in and I left for Germany. Think I didn’t get there until October, let me see, I got my record here. Germany was—where is it here, it’s on here.

 

Yeah, it was probably late summer that I left the campus as a Lieutenant Colonel. I was a Lieutenant Colonel when I was the professor of military science and I was a captain all the time when I was there as a first tour.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:24:16] So, briefly, on May 4^th, I know you said that you were told about the shootings, so you weren’t aware until someone told you, right? Like you didn’t hear firing or anything like that?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Well, if you remember where the ROTC Building is, and The Commons is right there. So, we were standing right there in the parking lot and there were students all over the place, up on the hills, everywhere, as you remember, the pictures depict the number of students. So, we were standing there and I remember there was some—and it was a possibility of someone on top of the architectural building with a rifle and that’s when they deployed the National Guard. And then, at one point, there was demonstrations going on, screaming and then up over the hill, we heard something. I remember someone saying, “Is that firecrackers?” And I said, “No, that’s a weapon firing.” From experience, so, and we didn’t know what happened. Did they fire in the air? Whatever happened, we did not see or was close enough to observe the actual assault.

 

[Interviewer]: When you heard the weapons go off, did you think that they were blanks, or could you tell that it was live fire based on the noise?

 

[Joe Cretella]: No, they were probably, from where the ROTC building is, all the way up to the architectural building, that’s a good 400, 500 yards, a considerable distance. So, we didn’t know if it was blanks, we didn’t know if it was live rounds, or how the weapons were fired: into the air, or straight at students.

 

[Interviewer]: When you heard the weapons go off, did you move closer to it? Did you move away? Did you stay put?

 

[Joe Cretella]: No, because, I remember, the crowd started moving that way, that the rush of people from The Commons area, down by where the ROTC Buildings were. Remember, there was three—across the street, there were three wooden buildings, two-story wooden buildings, the Air Force was in one of them, we had classes in the middle one, and, the first and second one, and then the ROTC Building was across the street with a little parking lot there. We were there and the crowd started—when they heard that going off, they started rushing, some started scattering, running off. So, we just stayed there. We did not move closer.

 

In fact, the other officer, Captain Terry Klinger, he’s an infantry officer, I was an armor officer with bigger guns. But he kind of looked at me and he said, “That’s right, that’s weapon firing.” And we didn’t know what to do and we were very much aware of what kind of occurred, but we weren’t sure what happened. That the weapons did fire, but we weren’t sure how it came off.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:27:50] Is there anything you would like to share about how these experiences have affected your life over the years?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Well, my youngest daughter who was born on May 3^rd, she calls herself “the May 4^th baby.” She went to Kent Roosevelt High School, on my second tour. So, she was quite—always talks about that Kent was one of her places that she was introduced to the crowds or the demonstrations, but it really didn’t affect my life. I know I did get a lot of people, in Germany when we arrived, there was a commander’s call and we had to introduce ourselves. The first guy that stood up, he was a captain, he stood up and he said, “So, I’m coming from Berkeley campus.” And everybody roared. So, then it was my turn and I stood up and I said, “I’m coming from Kent State.” They go, “Whoa!” They were just roaring, so, I became the Kent State guy in the Army. When you talk to different people, they all wanted to know what was going on. I did have a stack of pictures that were given to me by some of the security people and the FBI and some that I took myself. I’ve given them to your memorial. I assume they’ve been posted.

 

I have not been there. I do need to make a trip to visit the memorial because I do have a feeling for it. I spent almost seven, eight years on campus, so, totally. And so, I just feel like it was an experience that I hope I never have to share again, but it affected me a little bit. Especially after the next year when we had cadets. We always useda—that became a lot of the discussion in classes sometimes. Especially in military law class that I taught. That was part of the, how come this happened? And, who’s being charged, and all that kind of stuff.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:30:23] So, were you following the legal proceedings of the case in your class in some capacity?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Not so much. That was, like I said, that was in 1983 and ‘86 when I was teaching military law. So, yeah, so that was later. So, I had a trip to Germany and a couple other assignments in between. Rhen I was, in fact—I was in Washington at the Pentagon working and I got a call that, your tour is up. I said, “Yes, where am I going?” They said, “You’re going to Kent State.” Again.

 

A lot of people have talked to me around the world. I wasn’t able to follow the proceedings that much when I was in Germany after ‘73. I did see it, sometimes it was in the military paper about what was going on and some of the stuff, but I was not able to follow it that much. A friend of mine had all the news clippings and one day, he invited me over to the house and we went through all the news clippings that were in the newspapers, the Cleveland Plain Dealer, the Akron Beacon, the Kent paper [editor’s clarification: The Record Courier], so I did get to see some of that stuff.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:31:54] Briefly, I meant to ask this earlier, but I forgot. When you mentioned earlier that there had been talk of a sniper on the roof of the architecture building, was that something that you heard before the shooting started, or was it something that you heard—?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Before the shooting started.

 

[Interviewer]: Before?

 

[Joe Cretella]: Before. That was like—and that’s when I think the National Guard started moving towards that hill, because there was some military vehicles there with radios on them and we could hear some of the conversations going on.

 

[Interviewer]: [00:32:40] Okay. Is there anything else that you would like to talk about that we haven’t covered?

 

[Joe Cretella]: I don’t know if I’ve covered enough or missed something. But I certainly do remember when the State Police met me at the gate, down in front of Rockwell Hall, I forget the name of that street, Main [Street], going to Ravenna. I guess it was Route [editor’s clarification: State Route 59], there was an Arthur Treacher’s across the street. I remember that because I pulled into that lot and parked and ran across the street and there was a State Police cruiser there and that’s when they took me up to the building. Because they wanted to try to get the weapons out of the building, the ammunition out of the building, because it was the front part of the building that was burning first and then it moved towards the back. That’s why you see part of that still—structure in the pictures, standing. Because they threw the flares through the windows of the building.

 

[Interviewer]: Okay. Well, if that’s all, then I can stop the recording.

 

[Joe Cretella]: Okay. I don’t know if there’s anything else that I can think of. It’s pretty much, two tours there. And the second tour was very rewarding. There was never any, at that time, 1983-‘86, you figure the kids were like nine and ten years old when that was going on, they don’t remember much, but when they get to college. In ’83-‘86, it was a very rewarding assignment.

 

[Interviewer]: And there was no, nothing really going on on campus in relation to our deployment in Lebanon at that time, or was there?

 

[Joe Cretella]: No, nothing. I don’t remember anything like that. I do know we were over in—oh, I can’t think of the department it was. Maybe it was, I forget the name of the department, but I remember there was quite a few people that asked us to come over and speak at some of their classes. So, we did that in, probably in ‘73 time frame, ‘72 time frame. And then, the same thing was occurring when I was there in ‘83 to ’86. Because, for example, I changed our military history. I remember there was a challenge when I went to the curriculum meeting of our military history course. And the key was, I don’t think you guys are qualified to teach it. And I said, “I think we’re qualified.” I remember I went to the curriculum meeting and I said, “I think we’re very qualified to teach it, but we do have someone else teaching our class.” And it was the chair of the History Department was teaching our military history course. And the room got kind of quiet and someone said, “I think that’s a slam dunk.” I remember that one.

 

[Interviewer]: Yeah, I’d say so.

 

[Joe Cretella]: We were doing, like I say, we were doing guest speaking at some of the classes and the faculty, in that time frame, were very supportive, very, in fact, sometimes it was too supporting. And so, we had, like I say, ’83 to ’86 was just a great tour, great assignment, a lot of young people. I noticed that some of them who were on one of the broadcasts, they were all there. There was three or four of them on the ROTC panel, and I looked at them and I said, “Yeah, and I was your instructor.”

 

[Interviewer]: When, in the wake of the shootings, so like in the remainder of your first tour at Kent State, did you notice any change in the way that the professors themselves interacted with the ROTC, or the way that the students did, or—?

 

[Joe Cretella]: No, we were—well, our enrollment did drop down, yes. And there was a group of professors that we avoided and there was a group of professors that were very supportive. I think it’s like you just knew where to go and where not to go. But there was never any—I mean, they were questioning sometimes our ability to grant [college] credit and all that kind of stuff. But we were obviously subject matter experts in the areas that we were teaching. Then, in ’83-‘86, like I said, there was no confrontation. I remember the vice president, associate vice president, John Bender, he would come down to the class and talk because he was in law classes and he would give some insight into his perception of things on the military and the civilian world, in general.

 

I was the professor of military science. Dr. Terry Roark was the provost and my direct boss on campus. Who left to be the president out in Omaha, or Oklahoma, I don’t remember exactly.

 

[Interviewer]: Okay. That’s all the questions that I have.

 

[Joe Cretella]: Well, if you have more as you go through this and you think you need some clarification, please, don’t hesitate to call. I’ll be glad to clarify or provide some more. I don’t know what else I could say.

 

I know my wife was—well, I can tell you this other thing, when my wife was in the hospital, they said that there was a shooting on campus and it was military people. And so, she got very upset and finally, someone got ahold of me and says, “You need to call your wife immediately.” And I said yes and I called her and she said, “Oh, it’s not you?” And I go, “No, it’s not me. I don’t know who it is right now.” But she was very upset, at that point, because she just had the baby on Saturday. At that time, they kept them in the hospital I think for five days. Four or five days. Now, you stay four or five hours.

 

[Interviewer]: Thank you so much for your willingness to share your story with us. You were very thorough in a lot of ways and I really appreciate—

 

[Joe Cretella]: Yeah, because I’ve read everything on it and I don’t remember—because they talk about the fireman being sent back, or they pulled back. But I never heard anything where it said, “Mr. Peach and Captain Cretella moved the truck down and start putting water on the building.” I thought, that’s one of the things I have to get put into the history book.

 

[Interviewer]: Yes, sir.

 

[Joe Cretella]: And in Michener’s [00:40:17] book [editor’s clarification: James A. Michener’s book titled “Kent State: What Happened and Why”], you’ll see something about a captain and that captain is me.

 

[Interviewer]: Awesome, well, thank you so much for your willingness to share your story with us and it’s fascinating listening to it and just thanks again, really appreciate it.

 

[Joe Cretella]: All right. Call if you need more.

 

[Interviewer]: Yes, sir.

 

[Joe Cretella]: Or call for clarification. Thank you.

 

[Interviewer]: Yes, sir, thank you. You have a good one.

 

[End of interview]

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