Steve Hegedeos, Oral History
Recorded: May 2, 2015
Interviewed by: Rennie Greenfield
Transcribed by: Kent State University Research and Evaluation Bureau
[Interviewer]: This is Rennie Grenfield speaking on May 2, 2015, at Kent State University Special Collections and Archives as part of the May 4 Oral History Project. I’ll be speaking today with Steve Hegedeos and I’d like to begin with a few just biographical questions, a little bit of background first, where were you born? [Steve Hegedeos]: Budapest, Hungary.
[Interviewer]: Right, and when did you come to the United States? [Steve Hegedeos]: 1951, I was nine years old.
[Interviewer]: So you grew up mostly in the United States? [Steve Hegedeos]: In the Cleveland area, yes.
[Interviewer]: In the Cleveland area? Okay, and when did you first come to Kent State? [Steve Hegedeos]: '70.
[Interviewer]: Nineteen- oh, in 1970? [Steve Hegedeos]: No, I’m sorry, '69.
[Interviewer]: 1969? As an undergraduate or a graduate student at that point? [Steve Hegedeos]: As a graduate student.
[Interviewer]: Where did you do your undergraduate? [Steve Hegedeos]: Cleveland State and at Cuyahoga Community College before then.
[Interviewer]: And did you major in psychology? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: And-- [Steve Hegedeos]: Philosophy?
[Interviewer]: Psychology and philosophy? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: And your graduate work was in? [Steve Hegedeos]: Rehabilitation Counseling in the Education Department.
[Interviewer]: Excellent. At the time you came to Kent State were you yourself politically active? That is, did you follow the news closely or involve yourself in any movement at the time? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well, I followed the news, I always liked to do that, but I was not active in any way. It was prior to-- now I’m much more active, but the news was always something important to me and I kept pretty well informed about the events and affairs.
[Interviewer]: What was your main source of news at the time? The evening news? [Steve Hegedeos]: The radio-- the newspaper and radio.
[Interviewer]: Okay, WKSU? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: What was your view-- obviously in 1969 the protests had started-- what was your view as an outsider of the protests when you first got to campus? [Steve Hegedeos]: You know the background that-- before I was nine years old, before we came to the United States was the Second World War and I vividly remember the scenes and everything. I can relate back to early days, perhaps as young as three or four years old, because I can figure out where I was at that time, but from the destroyed buildings to the soldiers marching and all that kind of thing that had to do with the Second-- with the end of the Second World War.
So when I heard about the Kent State, to answer your question, I didn’t. It wasn’t so fantastic as it turned out to be. It seemed like, oh this is one of those bumps in the road or something like that, it didn’t seem that it’s going to materialize as a deep scar and effect as it had-- until it did and as I mentioned with Napoleon [Peoples] we literally-- one hour before the shooting, I was on the grounds over there. We were told to try to find some of our dorm kids and get them back, because they were concerned about too many people being in kind of in a condition of possibly, not a riot, but just to bring them home-- nobody would come home. But we went back home and an hour later the shooting happened. Well, the turmoil hit-- we didn’t know exactly what happened. I remember the kids coming back, "Oh, the National Guard, three students--nine..." or whatever as they were then always talking about the Vietnam War with the casualty counts of U.S. and that. So, it was kind of a joke, but in any event we didn’t know what happened until the next day-- the Huntley-Brinkley Report, we were all watching it together, and then the details came to me clear.
[Interviewer]: I want to back up just for a little-- [Steve Hegedeos]: [Inaudible]
[Interviewer]: No, no, I want to back up just for a little bit and talk about the environment on campus leading up to that. Did you notice an increase in the protests or was it pretty steadily-- before that? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well there were bumps, like Napoleon [Peoples] and I were sharing-- he’ll probably mention the same thing-- the black fraternity wanted to get started and they were kind of rejected. Vietnam- and we had a major rally at Kent- I can’t think of the name of the guy, but one of the Chicago seven guys who became a lawyer afterwards, I think just recently passed away- but it was a major rally on the front lawn. Talking about the Vietnam War, now this was before Cambodia was invaded or whatever. In any event, it was like a campus kind of a thing and I was older than the average even grad student, I’m seventy-three now and it seemed to be like one of those things. It didn’t hit me that it’s going to be as profound or consequential as it turned out to be.
[Interviewer]: So did you participate or go and listen to any of the teach-ins? Things like that? [Steve Hegedeos]: Not so much the teach-ins, but the rallies and our dorm would have get-togethers, but my fondest memory is that in our dorm, Arthur Goldberg-- used to be one of the Supreme Court judges and he turned that down and became- Kennedy appointed him to a U.N. Ambassador-- and he came on campus for whatever reason to speak and our dorm took it on as a project to invite him to our cafeteria. He came and it was absolutely marvelous-- from his manicured nails, his dress, his talk, and he'd relate to the kids. It was unbelievable how a world- renowned person could be as real and he was very good at giving advice to the kids, you know, don’t get overblown, but freedom of speech and all that. I mean he really gave a good lecture, there was months or maybe a little less than a year before the shooting actually happened. So those kinds of things were happening, but our biggest problem was just to make sure we cleaned up after the beer glasses.
[Interviewer]: Do you remember at the time what the attitude of the faculty and staff was toward the protests? Were they supportive or-- ? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well I remember that I was in grad school and it was a little different in grad school, but the general sense that I had is that Kent State was kind of conservative so they weren’t like hardline against or for anything, but it was like trying to discourage things rather than having strong political points of view. I get that from some of the professors I had, but also from the kids that I socialized with or got together with in our dorm who were undergraduates. There was no outstanding individual so to speak that would set the character of Kent. Now, I do realize that at that time Kent State undergrad population was like seventy percent female and also another seventy percent first-time college-- first-generation college attendants. So what this was is that all the rednecks sent their daughters here to become teachers. So it was kind of a milder school in that respect.
[Interviewer]: Interesting, and do you remember what the relationship was between the students and the towns- people in general because I know there were conflicts-- [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: But I mean did you have a sense of that when you got here that there was conflict? [Steve Hegedeos]: Only from heresay, only from what people were speaking of-- when we were out, we were treated well and it seemed to be no problem in terms of bars or whatever. That night, or that weekend, because it’s not only that night, we heard a lot of stories. We weren’t out then to personally witness, because we didn’t want to get involved in all the rampage, but things were happening at that time and we thought it would blow over, but of course it did not. But, during my one and a half years here I didn’t sense any kind of like negative, prejudice, or whatever. I mean it’s a college town, everybody did what they did in a college town and it was expected.
[Interviewer]: Sure. [Steve Hegedeos]: So it wasn’t any particular outstanding thing. I’m sure there were instances with certain students and business owners that happened throughout the course of time but basically I remember that it kind of clustered all around that weekend which hyped-up the reaction to the Cambodian invasion was the main precipitator and, of course, that brought in some outsiders, as we know.
[Interviewer]: So, correct, on April 30 Nixon decides to invade Cambodia, there were the protests on campus. Do you remember what it was like when the Guard first arrived? [Steve Hegedeos]: Ridiculous, as I said-- and I mean that. I lived through Second World War and I remember the tanks and all that. So, here we are at a girls' college, so to speak, and these-- not tanks, but Deuce-and-a-Halfs or whatever, all these military hardware lined up. I mean, my God, what was the point? We thought it was absolutely ridiculous and then I remember the story, which I told someone recently, that one of the girls went up to-- as the soldier was standing guard or something-- and she went up to the soldier, “What are you doing here?” and she put a flower in the barrel of the gun, because we all felt that this was way over reaction and it was. And after the fact, Rhodes was a good, fairly good governor, but he just overstepped, way overreacted. It would not have been that bad. The ROTC Building was a shack anyway. I mean it’s not good, it wasn’t right that it was burned down, but the reaction to it was much more severe and just precipitated something like that to happen and, of course, who shot who-- we still don’t know exactly.
[Interviewer]: Did you yourself have any interactions with the National Guard before the shootings anytime that weekend or-- ? [Steve Hegedeos]: No.
[Interviewer]: No. [Steve Hegedeos]: No, I was not in the military myself, but as we passed each other we would say hello or what not, sometimes we exchanged names, but that was about it. But there’s only a couple days when this all transpired so that wasn’t a great opportunity to socialize, but they were kind of-- to put it-- kind of stiff. They were probably scared as much as the students.
[Interviewer]: So, tell me about your experiences that weekend and then, of course, on Monday on the rally.
[Steve Hegedeos]: Okay, I mentioned some of that already, but it was the first nice day, beautiful day, pretty much like today, a little bit warmer and the first one, so people were eager to get outside so there was a-- given nature and then as the day went on we heard little rumbling of stories and this and that and the National Guard was already there, because the ROTC Building was already burned down and I remember it was walled off and they didn’t put it out, I mean it seemed like it fizzled to us, but little stories here and there. Again, keep in mind and-- I can’t say that any one of us predicted or anticipated something happening like drastic, it was something it wasn’t. It seemed to be, okay another day, but--
[Interviewer]: Did you have class that morning? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes. Yes.
[Interviewer]: And you went to class? Class was fairly normal? [Steve Hegedeos]: Right, we made comments, but the regular class was ongoing, whatever it was, whichever class it was. Yes, I had class every day, five days a week.
[Interviewer]: And were the Guards outside of the classrooms or the buildings or-- ? [Steve Hegedeos]: No they were only outside on the lawn areas or the-- they were not in the-- not that I know of, inside the buildings. All of my classes were in the Education Building which is a little bit removed from the ROTC or the front-- main front, that’s where most of the troops were and then later on as I came back to get some of the kids out I saw them assemble on the area where now the memorial is.
[Interviewer]: When you saw that happening, what did you think? [Steve Hegedeos]: I said, “What is this?” And I’m standing with the kids and the kids were like- I mean they were kids so this is a picnic kind of thing, they were having fun, but I couldn’t convince-- I mean look, what’s going on? And nobody cared, nobody cared. I mean not nobody. It just wasn’t, again, it wasn’t anticipated to be as intense as it became and there was like fun.
[Interviewer]: So it wasn’t taken very seriously? [Steve Hegedeos]: It was not taken seriously. What can you do when you’re a college student and you have a bunch of soldiers lined up to do whatever?
[Interviewer]: So it didn’t necessarily remind you of your experiences during World War II? [Steve Hegedeos]: That it did not, which is question, because it seemed ridiculous. Ridiculous is the word. It seemed ridiculous.
[Interviewer]: So you said you were on the Commons about an hour before the shootings? Just-- [Steve Hegedeos]: Trying to get the kids back-- kids meaning that they’re our resident dorms. I was on the eighth floor. Napoleon [Peoples] was on the third floor, but I remember when I was interviewed for the position, they told me that you’re going to get the toughest floor, because it was the top floor and the year earlier somebody dropped a watermelon on a car. That’s a mess, not only the watermelon, but the car. But those are the kind of stories that we’re told so we had to be careful. But I just met one of the residents here today, his name is Miller, Keith, I think, and anyhow he said, “Oh, we really liked you as a dorm counselor.” We had regular meetings and became friends, because I wasn’t that much older than they were and one of them was, of course, you know, the cartoonist-- what’s his last name again?
[Interviewer]: Ayers. Chuck Ayers. [Steve Hegedeos]: Ayers, yes.
[Interviewer]: He was in your dorm? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: On your floor? [Steve Hegedeos]: On my floor.
[Interviewer]: Oh, do you remember-- [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: Or did you have any incidents with him? Was he pretty well-- ? [Steve Hegedeos]: No, he was of an, not activist, but he spoke up and he was kind of a leader and he was shorter, not a very short guy, but he wasn’t a very tall guy. As it happened, that I got a job at Edwin Shaw Hospital and hired a P.R. lady and the P.R. lady-- this was more than a decade afterwards-- was already an ex-wife of Ayers. So that kind of, you know, six degrees of separation.
[Interviewer]: Were you counseling students on your floor at the time in your role as a counselor? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes, there were a couple of kids who had-- it was a real likable Japanese or Chinese--Oriental-- that had real trouble with English. Of course, I could relate to that, because I also was foreign born and then some academic problems and then some social problems that kids had and they were welcome. We were kind of set up nicely, the kids had their dormitories and two in a room, but we had a little, a very small, but an apartment. We could easily talk to somebody in private. Privately, plus we had like monthly, maybe every other month a group meeting out by the elevator and we discussed who needs what or whatever. We didn’t have one pretty close to the event where we discussed what's happening, we did not. That was not the case. But our job as a counselor, we actually were given a two-week training session on how to deal with-- although that was also my chosen reason to be here-- on how to deal with conflicts like that or when people come to you and how do you listen more than you talk and stuff.
[Interviewer]: Do you remember anything around the draft lottery? Were there students who had low draft numbers that came to you with any problems? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes, well not so much the lottery. There was one kid had a friend, maybe a brother, that was a draft dodger and I don’t know if this should be on here. He came to the dorm and his brother helped him and he was a draft dodger and then I told the administrator downstairs and he says, “Well, we got to do something. It can’t go on-- should turn him into the police." I said, “We cannot turn him in.” So I had to talk with him and tell him that he’s got to go, because he puts everyone in jeopardy, and he did. Now, in terms of the lottery, I don’t remember when the lottery started, wasn’t it '72 that it started? I don’t remember, because I don’t remember-- I just skipped the military. I had one year exposure and fortunately I wasn’t called, but I think the lottery happened afterwards and, in '72, I was-- I’m trying to figure out when the lottery started. I think it started after Kent State, I don’t remember exactly, but the lottery itself, I saw some of the signs downstairs about the lottery and then the memorial. There’s also that table that you check your number and I don’t remember discussing the numbers or any kid being concerned about being drafted.
[Interviewer]: Okay. [Steve Hegedeos]: I do know that one of my friends who wasn’t in the dormitory but two of my friends also attended here, they were both drafted after they flunked out.
[Interviewer]: And so did you do any counseling with people who had family in Vietnam or close friends in Vietnam? Was that an issue on students', on the minds of students? [Steve Hegedeos]: No.
[Interviewer]: No? [Steve Hegedeos]: No, I had friends, two good friends, not the same, but two other guys who died there. They were close, close friends, but not here. Not from students who had any concerns regarding Vietnam or family involvement or particularly danger of being drafted.
[Interviewer]: So, getting back, you said you were trying to get your students who were on the Commons back to their dorm rooms? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: And were you successful at that or no? [Steve Hegedeos]: Zero.
[Interviewer]: They did not listen to you? [Steve Hegedeos]: No. It was a nice sunny day as I mentioned and they’re all gathered, they’re like having a party-- “Get out of here.”
[Interviewer]: So you would say it was more of a party than a protest?
[Steve Hegedeos]: Absolutely, even after the shootings when the campus was-- the speakers came out and the campus was going to be evacuated in another hour. I mean people were trying to get rides to Florida and it was a hullabaloo. It was very much of almost a festive event. But, very few people really knew what actually happened. It was, "Oh, let's go! They shut the school down so we got free time, a month free," or whatever. It was very much a party-like atmosphere.
[Interviewer]: So when after you weren’t successful with getting the students back to the dorm, what did you do? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well, we were given-- we were told that the school would to be evacuated and we as employees have to remain, which we did and then awaiting further instructions, whatever that might have been.
[Interviewer]: That’s after the shootings? [Steve Hegedeos]: After the shootings.
[Interviewer]: Right, where were you when the actual shootings took place? [Steve Hegedeos]: Back at the dorm.
[Interviewer]: Did you hear them or did you have any sense of what was going on? [Steve Hegedeos]: No.
[Interviewer]: So it was only afterwards that you found out? [Steve Hegedeos]: Only afterwards. Napoleon [Peoples] mentioned a couple of things, I don’t know if I heard the any gunshots or not. I can’t say that I did, I wasn’t aware that I heard it. Afterwards you think that you did, but in any event I can’t say that I did or didn’t in any sense-- sense that something major has happened-- until the loud speakers came on, school was being shut down, and we were called in to Tom Alford, was the dorm director, and we were told that the-- you can stay here, kids have to go, they can’t be here. One of us left, one female counselor left, but in any event, we were told just to sit tight and see what happens. And then that night after the campus was evacuated we were told we had to go to another dorm. We said, "Why?" We had to actually go--
[Interviewer]: They shut your dorm down then entirely? [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: Did you get any reaction from students who came back to the dorms after the shootings? Were they saying anything about what had happened, were any of them present or-- ? [Steve Hegedeos]: It was kind of a melee and none of them did I directly interview to see how they felt about it but clearly some were disturbed about what they experienced.
[Interviewer]: And at that point-- [Steve Hegedeos]: Some were happy and some you could see that they were like, ”What’s going on?” But that would happen even if no shooting would have happened if they shut the school down.
[Interviewer]: Right, and so at that time you weren’t-- when they told you that the school was being shut down and campus was being evacuated, were you aware of what had happened? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well, we heard there was shooting, but as I mentioned they were joking about Vietnam-- or the National Guard-- three-- students-- six-- or whatever those numbers as they were that time also in every newscast telling them the casualty numbers for Vietnam. We took it as a joke and we didn’t know and even when we had our meeting saying that our school is going to be shut down and we have to remain, even then, Tom Alford and others did not know actually, they didn’t know actually what had happened. It took a while for people to sort it out.
[Interviewer]: So would you say it was days later before you really found out? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well, as I said, the next day on the Huntley-Brinkley Report-- some reporter got to it and they buttoned down the numbers.
[Interviewer]: Gotcha. So they shut down your dorm, you were moved to another dorm. [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes.
[Interviewer]: Do you remember which? [Steve Hegedeos]: Napoleon [Peoples] did, I’m sorry I forgot, but he remembered, it’s a smaller name but I don’t. It wasn’t as high as McDowell, like a two-floor, maybe three-floor dorm, but he’ll know.
[Interviewer]: And did you have any sense of now that the students are gone, what your duties were? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well, we were told just to sit down, but there was an eeriness about it, because they said that-- the rumor, there was a rumor that there’s-- backing up a little from the day before, because they were saying, even on the Huntley-Brinkley Report, that there were agitators, outsiders, involved. So it wasn’t clear that it was only the students. So the rumors afterwards was that there are some subversive elements trying to take advantage of it and they’re even trying to burn down the entire campus. So we were told to just sit tight and listen, but nothing ever happened.
[Interviewer]: At that point, was the campus mostly cleared out then? [Steve Hegedeos]: Mostly cleared out.
[Interviewer]: Who was left aside from you? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well, there were dorm counselors in several dorms, not all of them.
[Interviewer]: Did they move you all to that one? [Steve Hegedeos]: No, no, but we were in with some others. I guess maybe thirty, forty people remained. In our dorm, we had eight on each side so sixteen was the max. Not all of them stayed, but on the whole campus, about thirty, forty remained and I thought I had the picture, I should’ve brought that up here, but the next day, Tuesday I think, or maybe Wednesday, campus was shut down, things settled down and all this food was left over. So somebody figured it out-- on the frozen steaks, I’ve never seen so many frozen steaks and good steaks too. We went out and we had a barbeque-- as many steaks as we could, because it was a one-time deal, they weren’t gonna keep it. So if we don’t eat it, they throw it away, because there was no use for it.
[Interviewer]: Were the cafeteria workers still present? [Steve Hegedeos]: No, no most of the workers were not.
[Interviewer]: So you let yourself in and helped-- [Steve Hegedeos]: We were told it was okay.
[Interviewer]: Oh. [Steve Hegedeos]: We didn’t break in, we were allowed in, we had keys, because dorm counselors Sunday night could serve themselves, because there was no cafeteria service. But, in any event, we had a good steak cookout that day-- and I left the picture in Memorial Hall, but there’s a picture of my Cadillac which I bought for $300 and Napoleon [Peoples] and all the kids in our dorm, the male guys, not the females-- maybe the females were-- no, no, the females also stayed, but in any event, the guys, we had a barbeque of prime rib steaks.
[Interviewer]: Do you remember what the conversation was like at that time? Were you discussing what you were going to do about that semester? Your course work? [Steve Hegedeos]: That’s right. That was heavy, because none of us knew what's going to happen. We were close to graduating, matter of fact I intended to go through, like Napoleon [Peoples] did, follow through and get the PhD, I had 62 credits towards it, you need 65. Credit wise, I was almost there to stipulate my thesis and so on and to actually get accepted in the Psych Department or the Education Department and I had interviews and it was looking good, but all that fell, all that fell by the wayside and then afterwards, after we all were let go that summer I got a job and I never really came back. Napoleon [Peoples] came back to finish it, but I do remember they asked me how did I want to get-- I opted out without having to write a thesis, because time ran out and otherwise I would have to come back and take some more classes or whatever and they asked me how I want to do it and I said I opt out and then I got the diploma mailed rather than come back for the-- I don’t know if there was a ceremony, but I didn’t come back personally to accept it.
[Interviewer]: How long after were you still on campus? How long did you stay? [Steve Hegedeos]: Only a couple of weeks, but this deal about getting the diploma and all that was all done in August already. It was two months afterwards or so. I guess they needed the time to sort it out. I remember rumors saying that the entire school would be shut down because, again, it was the first-generation girls that attended, and who's going to send their kids to this college again? I certainly thought that Kent State had its days numbered, but it turned out not to be that way.
[Interviewer]: How did you occupy yourself in those couple of weeks? Other than having a barbeque what were you-- were you continuing your course work or? [Steve Hegedeos]: I was working on my thesis. I was doing some studies. We played a lot of ping-pong.
[Interviewer]: Was the library open? Were the campus buildings open that you could-- ? [Steve Hegedeos]: No, I don’t remember if the library was open or not. I don’t remember. I have to think about it, maybe it was or some part of it was but I remember we worked on our-- some of us worked on our-- academics, some of us played ping-pong, we watched TV, and we were waiting. It was kind of a holding pattern.
[Interviewer]: And then how were you informed that then you had to leave or did you choose to leave? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well the summer, the break-- this would have been three weeks before the normal break so we were told before the normal break that it’s obviously not going to restart. So like this is the actual quarter break and then we went home.
[Interviewer]: So since May 4th, did you become more politically active afterwards? You said you weren’t really involved in any necessarily-- in a protest movement-- after the Kent State shootings did you become more active or did your views change? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well for thirty-five years later, no twenty-five years later, I ran for mayor of my township. So, politics was always something interesting to me to participate, but politics is not all protest. I tend not to like protests, I think really the good deals are made when they’re made between people who understand each other and protests are too adversarial even though our legal system is adversarial. Protests-- you don’t really get anything accomplished. So it’s not my thing. Now, did I protest anything or was I-- I spoke out against Governor Rhodes. Later on, as a part-time musician, later on I even played for his attempt to come back as governor-- didn’t work. Because he wasn’t totally at fault, but I wanted to meet the guy and I actually did and I told him I was at Kent State. “Oh, yeah, yeah.” I couldn’t have any more words with him.
[Interviewer]: You didn’t get to speak with him any further? [Steve Hegedeos]: No, he had a reception at the Akron Airport, Akron/Canton Airport. I took my accordion and played and had a relatively small-- I actually have a picture of that, but-- and I didn’t want to like shove it in his face-- and he lost the senator after that, his reputation was shot, because he overreacted. In one of their pamphlets it shows that he called the protestors Nazis, oh my God, even then it was bad.
[Interviewer]: Is there anything else that you wanted to talk about that we haven’t covered? Is there-- are there any other areas? [Steve Hegedeos]: Well, not so much specific to the incidences of the shootings, but look around the world today and including this week in Maryland with what has happened and that was a protesting story. I mean it had to do with protests. You’re probably aware of the outcome of six being indicted.
[Interviewer]: Uh huh. [Steve Hegedeos]: And one female, three black, three white policeman being indicted. The idea that instead of policeman we had to deal with the National Guard here. The idea of reacting by overreacting by force is probably worse-- the cure is worse than the disease-- generally, and we’re still doing it. So why didn't we learn from Kent State? Well, some people don’t learn easy, they have to evolve, I guess, it takes generations.
[Interviewer]: How do you see the legacy of those events? Do you see lessons learned on, because you mentioned the protest in Baltimore and they did call out the National Guard in Baltimore. [Steve Hegedeos]: Yes, yes.
[Interviewer]: I mean do you see lessons that have been learned or lessons that are opportunities that have not been-- ? [Steve Hegedeos]: The way I see it is motivational and that’s why I’m so eager, I was eager to come here. Even though it’s the forty-fifth and perhaps the fiftieth would be a bigger event. We have to keep reminding people and whatever we can do to remind them that this happened. Look, I mean, God, learn, don’t just do the same old foolish things. I mean some of the protests, like in Baltimore, I mean them burned a building and burned cars-- that doesn’t do any good. Would there have been indictments as there were, probably, probably. So does everything, or like Ferguson, did it work? It did not work there. It wasn’t fair that somebody should kill somebody and then, well, gone free. Not that he should be in jail all the time, but accountability matters and Rhodes paid by not being re-elected, or not being elected. He was governor and his term expired and then we ran for senate, or wanted to. But, if we keep reminding people that people can get shot when you protest, I mean what was it about? When Nixon made his political, but more a military move, was that incorrect, was that wrong? Well, you look back at history and maybe might not have been wrong. Could he have done it earlier? Definitely, definitely so. Did he have some political motives that interfered with the better resolution? Absolutely. We heard that-- we know that from the McNamara papers and all that. So again, the idea of overreacting with force-- when will we learn? So we gotta remind people of Kent State and, from my point, I can remind them of World War II, but I was only a two-year old kid but at Kent State I was already an adult in grad school and I talk about it all the time when I make speeches or whatever.
[Interviewer]: That’s what I wanted to ask you in the years sense, what do you do? You mentioned playing accordion for Governor Rhodes but obviously you have other careers? [Steve Hegedeos]: Oh yes, I was in health care when I was in Baltimore at Johns Hopkins. You make speeches and I always made references, I even have it on my resume, I don’t make the shootings part of the resume, but certainly people are not clear about the time and when they ask, almost everyone did ask and I tell them I was there, like I was there at the Second World War, kind of in a joke-- in a humorous way, but I don’t mind talking about it in every chance-- I don’t want to push it, but every chance I have I do talk about it.
[Interviewer]: What do people usually ask you when they-- [Steve Hegedeos]: “Oh really? Well, what happened?” So I tell them more or less of what I’ve said to you, perhaps not as lengthy.
[Interviewer]: Well is there anything else you’d like to mention? [Steve Hegedeos]: Let me think.
[Interviewer]: Yeah, please, I don’t want to let you go-- [Steve Hegedeos]: Well, it’s not that I’m testifying to anything that will come in the future, because I can’t do that, but is there-- should I say something that reflects beyond what I already said that we should learn? Just keep it up. I mean keep the attention appropriately. Not necessarily in manners of the streets, appropriately-- on the wrong thing that happened, keep it in front of people’s eyes. The Holocaust Museum has done that.
[Interviewer]: Thank you so much for taking time to speak with us today.
[Steve Hegedeos]: I wasn’t sure how to pronounce your name. Rennie?
[Interviewer]: Rennie. [Steve Hegedeos]: Rennie.
[Interviewer]: Greenfield, yes that’s me. [Steve Hegedeos]: Rennie, you’re a good interviewer.
*End of recording*
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