Recorded statement of Richard Siciliano conducted by the Commission on KSU Violence.

[Unknown Speaker]: Alright, the date is, what, July–

[Richard Siciliano]: 20th

[Unknown Speaker]: –20th, okay. If you could give your name and address.

[Richard Siciliano]: Richard Siciliano, I live at 730 Beryl Drive, Kent, and my statement is about what I saw take place on May the 4th at approximately 12:00–from approximately 12:00 noon to 12:30.

A friend of mine, Mr. Carpenter, and myself left the University School at approximately 12:05 and walked up to the campus. And as we walked along Portage Drive, we saw the Guardsmen walking down toward The Commons. We walked down after them. When we got there, we saw them all lined up along the bottom of The Commons there facing Taylor Hall, and there was a large group of students up by Taylor Hall, chanting and hollering, and many, many bystanders standing around on the side there toward Stopher Hall.

And right after we got there, they proceeded–the Guardsmen started to proceed. They were in a skirmish line and they proceeded towards the people with guns in their hands and they were shooting teargas off to their–what would be to their right, towards Stopher Hall, toward the dormitory. Several of the canisters bounced off Stopher Hall, a lot of it falling in among the bystanders off to the side.

And then they shot the teargas toward the students. It was very ineffective because, in the first place, they were going against the wind, so it wasn’t really–it wasn’t even getting toward the students–getting up to where the students were. And, pretty soon they got close enough to where it hit up to where the students were and some of the students threw it back–threw the teargas canisters back. Then the students dispersed from where we were standing, we could see them leaving the area, and the Guardsmen went up over the top of the hill.

Then we proceeded up toward the hill there, and right when we got even with about where the bell was on The Commons there, some kids came out and started ringing the bell–about three kids I guess it was. And about the same time, some Guardsmen came from around–I think it’d be the north side–about the north side of Taylor Hall there, and they saw these kids ringing the bell and they ran down there, and the kids ran away, and they were shooting teargas at them. And a lot of the teargas was going into the crowd, naturally. About that time, some of the people in the crowd were getting a little bit mad and they started picking up clumps of dirt and throwing it at some of the Guardsmen.

And right after that, this one boy was by himself, and he was walking across the walk from Johnson Hall, across that walk that goes behind Taylor–around The Commons’ side of Taylor. And the Guardsmen saw him walking up there. They were about, I’d guess 50-70 yards away from the guy and he was–had a bunch of books in his hands. He wasn’t doing anything but walking at the time, and they shot teargas at him. And the kids–they hit pretty close to him and he got a good dose of it and he started dodging around, kind of trying to get out of it. One Guardsman ran up and grabbed him and started clubbing him with a club, and the kids that were standing there were pretty mad. They started running toward the Guardsmen and we were shouting to him to “leave the kid alone, he hadn’t done anything.” Some of the kids there then picked up some–they were mostly clumps of dirt, there were probably some stones from around the shrubbery and they were throwing them at him–at the Guardsmen. I turned around and was shouting at the kids to get out of there before they got shot because you could see the Guardsmen were really kind of–you know, on edge.

So they stopped and moved back and the kid–in the meantime, this kid had broken away. So, then, we started toward the top of the hill there, right between Taylor and Johnson, and just as we got toward the top we saw the Guardsmen coming back up, so we got out of the way and they stopped and they about-faced and they fired–you know, just about that fast. There was no hesitation–they just came up to the top of the hill and stopped, turned around, they were in ranks and they fired. And then they moved back down past us, back down The Commons and pretty soon some fella who was a civilian–he was dressed in civilian clothes–he came running back over the hill, he had a camera. And some kids came screaming, running over the hill saying, “Stop the guy, stop the guy–he shot somebody.” So this friend of mine, Mr. Carpenter, and I started chasing after the guy and hollering to the Guardsmen to stop him. He got clear over The Commons onto Portage Drive and across Portage Drive, and finally somebody did stop him. A Guardsmen got in front of him, and then I guess–I assume they were State Police, I don’t know–came over and they took charge of him. Apparently they took something from him. I found out later on he did have a gun.

So we started then–we started back up toward The Commons and a couple of kids came running over the hill screaming to send an ambulance, that somebody was shot. They weren’t doing anything, they were just standing near the Guardsmen, the ambulance was sitting there–nobody was doing anything, they didn’t send any ambulance or anything. And then, I found out later it was Dr. Frank came running over the hill hollering for an ambulance. They still didn’t do anything until he got all the way down there on The Commons and he talked to somebody down there for maybe about a minute and they finally sent the ambulance up. And then I had a class coming, so I had to leave and go back to school [unintelligible]. Prior to the firing by the National Guard, I hadn’t seen any or heard any shots fired. From where I was standing, when they came up the hill, they had–well, there was nobody around–I mean, you know, surrounding them–there were people standing all over the place, but there was certainly nobody pushing them back against the wall or anything like that, and they–and that was about all I saw there.

[Unknown Speaker]: Now, this young chap whom the National Guardsmen were clubbing–you say he was just walking across with his books?

[Richard Siciliano]: Yeah, he was just walking across with his books.

[Unknown Speaker]: He was not the one that was ringing the bell–

[Richard Siciliano]: No.

[Unknown Speaker]: The reason I ask is that I have another account that says it was the bell ringer who was assaulted by the Guard.

[Richard Siciliano]: No, they didn’t even get the guy that was ringing the bell.

[Unknown Speaker]: [unintelligible]

[Richard Siciliano]: In fact, at that time, there was Mr. Bruss, I saw come walking across the campus right after it happened, and I asked him if he had seen this incident and he said no, he hadn’t seen it. They didn’t even see anybody who was ringing it. They might have thought it was the guy ringing the bell because one of the people ringing the bell I guess had on a white shirt and this fellow had a white shirt on, but he wasn’t ringing the bell.

[Unknown Speaker]: Have you been in service?

[Richard Siciliano]: Yes.

[Unknown Speaker]: What branch?

[Richard Siciliano]: Four years Marine Corps.

[Unknown Speaker]: From your judgment, when the Guard turned, did they turn as though they were turning on order?

[Richard Siciliano]: It looked to me like they had get–I didn’t hear any commands, but that’s what it looked like, they didn’t–it wasn’t–there was no milling around, they got up there and turned around and, you know–when they shot, it wasn’t sporadic-type firing, it’s the same kind of firing you get on a rifle range where you get the command, you know, lock and load, ready, aim, fire, and then zap–everybody shoots. And it stopped just as quickly as it started. There was no one shot and then another shot, you know. It was just all at once, bang.

[Unknown Speaker]: Did you hear any noise right before the shooting that might have distracted the Guard and forced them to turn around?

[Richard Siciliano]: No. I–well, nothing other than all the hollering and shouting that was going on, but nothing like–you know, I didn’t hear any shots or anything of that nature, or anything that sounded like a shot.

[Unknown Speaker]: Now, would that maneuver have necessitated a series of commands?

[Richard Siciliano]: It–it all–I don’t know, it depends on, you know, what they’d said before they came up the hill, if they had decided when they got to the top of the hill to wield, but it wouldn’t have taken many. They got up there, they wield, and it would have–if it was done on command, they would have been–have to’ve been given a command to stop and then about-face, form ranks, and fire, which, they couldn’t have done–I didn’t hear anything.

[Unknown Speaker]: Now, there were sixty men there–would this constitute two squads?

[Richard Siciliano]: In the Marine Corps, that would constitute over two platoons–almost two platoons.

[Unknown Speaker]: Alright, well then would it have constituted two platoons–could it have?

[Richard Siciliano]: I would say, yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]: Then, is it pos–

[end of tape 1]

[start of tape 2]

[Unknown Speaker]: Is it possible that the two platoons could have been under two different sets of orders then?

[Richard Siciliano]: It’s possible, but they had the commanding–there was the overall commander was with them. Canterbury supposedly was right with them. Usually, if you have two squads–or two platoons, there’s a company commander who has overall command. They should be operating under the same orders. Unless they’re separated and on their own, which they apparently were.

[Unknown Speaker]: You had no experience with Friday night, Saturday, Sunday, or any previous times.

[Richard Siciliano]: No, just Monday.

[Unknown Speaker]: Are there any experiences that you have had since–that might be related to the events of Monday?

[Richard Siciliano]: No, other than just conversations with people. I haven’t seen anything going on.

[Unknown Speaker]: Okay, fine. Thank you.













 


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